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Mac OS X installer

  • Started by vilem
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  • Shai
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"Cmk" from now will be the official 3 letter abbreviation Colemak abbreviation. Using two letter abbreviation is strongly discouraged, but if one must be used, "Cm" is preferred.

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Aww, and I made a spiffy picture and everything. :)

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  • From: Viken, Norway
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[I made a post full of ligature attempts here, but I've decided it belongs in a topic of its' own so we don't clutter up Vilem's Mac Installer topic. Sorry about the mess, Vilem and others!  ;) ]

Moved to:
https://forum.colemak.com/viewtopic.php?pid=3143

Last edited by DreymaR (20-Jun-2008 18:17:27)

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I like that very last one, where the ascender on the 'k' mirrors the height of the capital 'C'. Could you perhaps move the 'C' a little closer so that the bottom half blends into the 'm' and the top overhangs it so that you can get the ligature effect back?

I'm not so sure about the rounded font. As you mentioned, it's very Web 2.0 in style. What about a nice, solid geometric sans or a slab serif? Also, a font where the two arms of the 'k' are symmetrical might mirror the 'C' more effectively.

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  • From: Viken, Norway
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I agree - the last one has something. The problem with moving the 'C' in is that it starts looking like a 'G' when it touches the left stem of the 'm'. I did a bold experiment and moved it even further then lopped off the bottom part of the left 'm' stem. It's an interesting effect, and actually allows a 1:1 ratio which is nice for icons and rare for text. I'll upload it when I can.

I like the chunky fonts since it has to work at small sizes. Tried Bauhaus but didn't quite succeed. Any concrete examples of fonts you'd like to see? By slab serif, I'm reminded of Courier and other typewriter-like fonts. That's possible and it'd remind people of typing... but on the other hand it reminds me of old-fashioned typing which I'd like to avoid. Any less typewriter-like faces you'd recommend?

If the VAG is too much, maybe a Futura could be a workable middle ground? Or maybe Century Gothic Bold? That also has the symmetric 'k' arms you're looking for.

Last edited by DreymaR (17-Jun-2008 08:53:03)

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I went poking around in my Font Book and did a bit of surfing on Wikipedia, and I came up with a list of fonts that show promise.

The two you suggest -- Futura and Century Gothic -- would both be good. Gill Sans is a similar but slightly more stylish font, with an unusually wide 'C' and a barely there 'k'. If you have the Vista fonts (or access to them), Corbel looks nice -- sort of half-way between Futura and Gill Sans.

As for slab serifs, if you're not keen on Courier, then Rockwell (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rockwell_%28typeface%29) may be an option. It's both slab serif and geometric, and has what may be the most beautiful lower case 'k' ever made.

And finally, (Vista fonts permitting) Consolas is an option. It's monospaced, which means that it has a very tight 'm' -- perfect if you are aiming for that 1:1 ratio.

(/font geek)

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  • From: Köln, Germany
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Hmm, so Colemak is Cmk from now on? I'm not sure I like your Cmk ligature, Drey. It looks childish and untidy. I think the best so far was korivak's planet solution, but I guess it's out of question now.
I would use Helvetica Neue. It's modern (neue=new), it's not monospaced and sans-serif (therefore eliminating that 'typewriter' look, which is the most unsuitable type of font for a Colemak logo!)
It's a shame Cmk is the official Colemak abbrev., because it's really hard to make it look good. Co is nice, because it bears so many typographical possiblities and is consistent with the logo for other layouts on a mac (Dvorak -> Dv).

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I didn't make a Cmk ligature; I made several and I'm not sure which one you're referring to as childish and untidy or whether you mean all of them but had a mental and/or lingual slip. In any case, why not discuss that over in the new thread instead?

As I said, of course it'd be graphically easier if Co were a useful abbreviation for Colemak. Unfortunately, it isn't. However, if you're making layout system icons then take Shai's explicit (if careful) hint and use 'Cm' for consistency with the other two-letter icons. I agree that a three-letter icon could easily get too crowded, but 'Cm' says 'Colemak' whereas 'Co' does not.

Last edited by DreymaR (21-Jun-2008 15:25:33)

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Drey: All of them. And, yes I am trying to use Cm, but it just looks horrible and is – as I have said – inconsistent with the Dvorak symbol. Consistency is important, although I can't comment on how Windows does this. To me, and I think most others, by now Co means Colemak. I've gotten used to it. Can't we just stick with it, Shai?

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  • Shai
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Co is way too ambiguous to my taste, and I don't think it really caught on. Cm is more identifiable as Colemak, and I prefer it over Co.

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I looked around for some more info.

According to Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Co and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ISO_639-1_codes):
- Co stands for an ethnic group, Cobalt, Company (!) ...
- co stands for the Corsican language Corsu, the Colombian net domain and more

- Cm stands for C minor, Curium ...
- cm stands for centimetre, and the Camerunian net domain

Looks fairly even, unless one counts that co stands for a language and cm doesn't; that might be thought to affect disambiguation slightly. More importantly to me are the prefixes 'co-' and 'col-' which really throw off Co(l).

'Cm' is in accordance with a syllabic split into 'Cole-mak', which for me makes it a superior abbreviation. I don't think 'Dvorak' gives itself to such a split since it's an actual personal name, and the resulting 'Dr' would certainly be confusing. One might argue that if 'Colem-' comes from 'Coleman' then the abbreviation should be 'Ca' but that obviously won't work at all!

I tried to find anything on the 'Dv' symbol and whether that in turn is consistent with anything else, but I drew a blank. That doesn't matter too much to me though.

I don't believe the 'Co' is all that established. I always thought it was unintuitive, but just didn't say anything before.

Vilem: If your designs look horrible it may just be because you haven't found the right way yet. There are several, I'm sure of it; it just takes a good design. I don't think your criticisms have been constructive but luckily we have others. And I'll ask a few real designers I know for tips, while I'm at it.

Last edited by DreymaR (23-Jun-2008 11:49:18)

*** Learn Colemak in 2–5 steps with Tarmak! ***
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  • From: Köln, Germany
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Hmm, from a design point of view I still think that 'Co' is better. But i suppose this is irrelevant. And I must say I have to agree that 'Cm' is more logical. I'll have to try harder finding a good-looking 'Cm' logo, I guess. :)

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[I tried making some 16x16 'Cmk' icons for the site icon and elsewhere; see the logo topic]

Last edited by DreymaR (25-May-2009 10:08:01)

*** Learn Colemak in 2–5 steps with Tarmak! ***
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