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    carpalx Improved-Colemak Layouts

    • Started by TaylanUB
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    09-Oct-2009 17:42:40#1 carpalx Improved-Colemak Layouts

    I'm one of those people who really get obsessed over perfection once they get interested in a specific subject.
    Thus naturally it hasn't taken me much time to find and start `researching´ Colemak, carpalx, and the other alternatives after i first heard of Dvorak.

    Having read quite a lot of stuff (but not tried anything myself; typical for me), it seems that Colemak is the near-ultimate (if not THE ultimate) keyboard layout in terms of writing in English, and for usual keyboards. (The extreme ergonomic ones are just too exaggerated IMO. You can still keep software with you for switching keyboard layouts on a foreign PC; but not a whole, unusually large keyboard.)

    The only real Colemak-competitors seem to be the Improved-Colemak layouts from carpalx.

    The GYLMWP layout (ZXCV stationary) has already been discussed in this thread.
    The performance-testing method that SpeedMorph uses has found Colemak to be actually better.

    But what i couldn't find is any discussion on the PBFMWJ layout; the one that allows relocation of the ZXCV keys.

    (Keeping ZXCV stationary, Colemak might be really THE ultimate layout. But i just don't care about those keys or anything similar at all.)

    So i was going to ask, what do other performance-testing methods, and you guys here, have to say on that layout?
    Any obvious flaws or anything? Matter of preference?
    Any opinions welcome!

    Regards,
    Taylan

    ``Common sense is nothing more than a deposit of prejudices laid down by the mind before you reach eighteen.''
    ~ Albert Einstein

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    09-Oct-2009 21:26:30#2 Re: carpalx Improved-Colemak Layouts

    My advice would be to learn Colemak, and then, once you've reached a decent speed (50-60wpm) which should take you a few weeks or so, decide if you're happy or whether another layout may suit you better.

    Most of us here have learnt at least three layouts (QWERTY, Dvorak and Colemak) and are generally very happy with Colemak. All of the carpalx layouts are pretty similar to Colemak in terms of home row usage etc. The main benefit of Colemak is the installation files, the 'brand awareness' for want of a better term, and the support on the forum. Carpalx has none of these.

    Good luck on what you decide.

    Edit: The ZXCV issue is a small one. If you look at the 'full optimization' layouts on the carpalx site, you'll notice that the movements of these letters are generally minimal. QWERTY and Colemak have them placed in a good position, in other words.

    Last edited by simonh (09-Oct-2009 21:43:12)

    "It is an undoubted truth, that the less one has to do, the less time one finds to do it in." - Earl of Chesterfield

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    10-Oct-2009 03:45:53#3 Re: carpalx Improved-Colemak Layouts

    I don't think the Carpalx layouts are very good. Carpalx has sophisticated algorithms, but its actual criteria are suboptimal. I think the layouts I've designed (http://mtgap.wordpress.com/2009/09/12/n … m-release/) are the best. After that, Colemak is very good. But I think that Carpalx has way too many same-finger repetitions to be fast or comfortable. That isn't to say you shouldn't try it out if you want to. Carpalx may suit you just fine. Play around with it. Learning a new keyboard layout doesn't take all that long, assuming you have some free time on your hands.

    Performance testing is, in the end, subjective. Carpalx probably uses some sort of scoring algorithm. A number of people (me, phynnboi, Michael Capewell (http://www.geocities.com/smozoma/projects/keyboard/), Peter Klausler (http://klausler.com/evolved.html)) have used computer programs to score a keyboard. These are based on subjective measures and require playing around with it, though. And actually determining what criteria you want can be tricky.

    My typing speed record: http://hi-games.net/typing-test/watch?u=493

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    10-Oct-2009 06:29:12#4 Re: carpalx Improved-Colemak Layouts

    What testing does Shai use? Is it open-source?

    And isn't there something like a comparison of the comparing-techniques? =P

    I see all the measurements are subjective; i would be interested in testing the layouts in each of them.

    ``Common sense is nothing more than a deposit of prejudices laid down by the mind before you reach eighteen.''
    ~ Albert Einstein

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    10-Oct-2009 07:58:41#5 Re: carpalx Improved-Colemak Layouts

    I think Shai used an algorithm to establish a basis, then just used his subjective and aesthetic sense to refine that into Colemak. I don't really believe in algorithms as the absolute truth. Remember that the output of the algorithm reflects your scoring system. Since the scoring system is supposed to reflect the subjective it will likely be inferior to an actual subjective evaluation.

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    11-Oct-2009 17:37:51#6 Re: carpalx Improved-Colemak Layouts

    OK, i'll use Colemak for now.

    But i might actually end up making my own layouts one day!

    ``Common sense is nothing more than a deposit of prejudices laid down by the mind before you reach eighteen.''
    ~ Albert Einstein

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