• You are not logged in.

    I consider switching from Dvorak to Colemak

    • Started by Mecki
    • 5 Replies:
    • Reputation: 0
    • Registered: 16-Nov-2010
    • Posts: 5

    Hello everyone!

    As promised in the General section, I'd like to make a quick post about my experience with Colemak. Let me first give a very short introduction: I started touch typing on QWERTZ, this is the German QWERTY layout (Z and Y are swapped on the German keyboard) and I was pretty good at it. However, as the German layout needs Umlauts (ä, ö, ü), a lot of less common keys (e.g. square/curly brackets) are in very awkward positions or can only be typed using an "ALT GR" key combination. This is fine if you type text most of the time, but I have always been a hobby programmer and now do programming for a living. As a programmer, you need those less common keys pretty often and thus I switched to the US QWERTY layout, just because of those keys. This made Umlauts impossible to type, so I stopped using them in German texts. You can replace them by ae, oe, ue if you have to. Hardly anyone does that nowadays, but most Germans won't have a problem reading that, especially since the pronunciation of ae, oe, ue pretty much equals ä, ö, ü. The two dots were originally two strokes and two strokes evolved out of a the letter "e", see here for details. I even did so in official documents and nobody ever complained about it. I know some other programmers that do that as well, and for all people that learned German as a 2nd or 3rd language it may also be more comfortable to use their "native" keyboard layout, which often features no Umlauts.

    About 6 years ago I discovered Dvorak on the Internet and it sounded like a great idea to me. I always knew there must be something wrong with QUERTY, as the layout doesn't make a lot of a sense from a logical perspective. Being a programmer, I like things that are logical and I couldn't find out what logical pattern QWERTY should be following (common keys are not in easy to reach positions, frequency of keys is totally unbalanced between hands, and so on), thus it was illogical to me. Switching to Dvorak was really hard and it took me about a full year to get close to old speed again; however, I didn't switch to type faster, I was fast enough before. I switched to type more comfortable, it's all about ergonomics to me. I would always accept a slower typing speed if that means a less strain to fingers and hands. About the same time I also switched to a Mac computer and that had a huge advantage: Even though Dvorak has no Umlauts either, I was finally able to type them again. On a Mac you type ALT+U to just get the "two dots" as a dead-key, then you type a, u, o and you get the appropriate Umlaut. Not that this is very comfortable or fast, but good enough for the few German texts I had to type.

    Am I unhappy with Dvorak? Not really. Using a different keyboard layout than pretty much the rest of the world surrounding can be annoying, especially if you have to use a computer that doesn't has the layout available and you have no way to get it there, but nowadays almost every OS has Dvorak as option available (I guess many people here wish that would be true for Colemak, too). Dvorak might have some downsides as pointed out in the FAQ of this page, but maybe except for the L position, I never felt like any of these are a real problem (e.g. neither typing ls (LS), nor having Cut/Copy/Paste in a different potion ever was a problem for me). Dvorak is definitive good layout, no question, but that doesn't mean Colemak cannot be better :-) Programmers also tend to head for perfection, so if Colemak is maybe better than Dvorak, why not using Colemak? At least I should give it a fair chance, so here I am.

    The main difference I have noticed so far between Dvorak and Colemak is that Dvorak focuses more on hand alternation, while Colemak focuses more on combos (e.g. a rolling motion). There are many arguments what is better and so far I'm not convinced that combos are so much better. E.g. the following post came to the result, that neither full alternation nor full combos are very fast. If some key combination is very fast, it is usually a combination of both. However when something is slowing typing down, it is rather a combo than an alternation. Actually alternations have the lowest "worst case" potential and the worst cases are what slows us down the most.

    The following words (words that I type more frequently) are very hard for me to type in Colemak, as they are either typed (almost) by one hand only (I'm not used to typing that much with one hand only, remember, I'm a Dvorak user),  may use the same finger twice in a row or are otherwise somehow unpleasant or awkward to type:

    online, data, cd, cat, atx, http, anime, gcc, xargs, status, kill, password, sparse, text, mpg, file, again, xargs, you/your, as ... as, void

    And I just found out that the following phrase is entirely right handed: "join me in"

    We will see, if that is just, because I'm currently still an extreme Colemak beginner (doing Colemak by night and Dvorak by day, since the layouts are so different that I need a hard cut between them!) or if they will stay hard to type.

    Dvorak is not that alternating BTW. I wrote a little HTML page with some JavaScript code to better visualize hand alternation. You can feed some text to the JS code via a text field and when you hit the button, it will print out the text three times, once for QWERTY, once for Dvorak and once for Colemak, coloring all letters written by the left hand in blue and all written by the right one in red. For most texts QWERTY and Colemak are pretty similar, QWERTY favors the left hand, while Colemak the right one. Dvorak looks more balanced IMHO and while some words are highly alternating (e.g. "sometimes"), most words consist of two or three consecutive right hand keys, interrupted by one or two consecutive left hand keys (this is probably because all vowels are on the left).

    Two final closing comments: German and English have a very similar letter frequency (except Y, which is almost unused in German, that's why Y and Z are switched on German keyboards) and also many similar two letter combination (with the exception of "th" which does hardly exist in German at all), so I don't think Colemak will be a problem for German texts. You can see this pretty nice looking at that this picture.

    And last but not least: This post was made during the day, thus it was made with Dvorak. If I make a post during the night, don't expect it to be that long ;-)

    Last edited by Mecki (25-Nov-2010 00:30:01)
    Offline
    • 0
    • Reputation: 214
    • From: Viken, Norway
    • Registered: 13-Dec-2006
    • Posts: 5,361

    Nice treaty!  :)  I can see that you like typing - good!

    For the Umlaut/Diaeresis, I use a Linux-like approach: The colon key (for its mnemonic likeness to an umlaut) together with AltGr is a dead key for the accent. Similarly, the apostrophe key gives me the acute accent, the hyphen gives macron and the comma cedilla etc. - all fairly intuitive. Since I need umlauts and acute accents relatively often, it makes sense to have these in easily available positions on the keyboard. I think it works very well for me.

    ß is on AltGr+S of course, and other characters necessary for me like þ and ð have also got easy AltGr mappings. This isn't the standard Colemak way of handling international characters, but then I consider the main key positions and AltGr/deadkey mappings to be two entirely separate issues for the most part.

    *** Learn Colemak in 2–5 steps with Tarmak! ***
    *** Check out my Big Bag of Keyboard Tricks for Win/Linux/TMK... ***

    Offline
    • 0
    • Reputation: 0
    • Registered: 16-Nov-2010
    • Posts: 5

    Actually the Colemak way of typing umlauts (AltGr + q/y/;) is not that bad. It's faster than using a dead key and I already memorized those positions pretty well. Typing upper case umlauts is a bit annoying (as you need Shfit+AltGr for that), but fortunately upper case umlauts are very rare in German texts. Regarding ß, it's the same as in Dvorak on Mac, AltGr + s does the trick and since the orthography reform 1996, ß became a rather rare character, since many words are now written with ss instead of ß. The Swiss don't have a ß at all, they always use ss for that case. I only know a single word, where this can lead to confusion: "Masse" and "Maße". "Masse" is "mass" or "matter" and "Maße" is the plural of "Maß", which means "measure"; but within a sentence the context is usually obvious.

    BTW, I'm not as good at typing as I though: According to various typing tests, I can maybe type about 72 WPM using Dvorak, with peaks up to 85 WPM. This is okay, but I thought I am faster :-P On the other hand, I'm not trained to typing and reading at the same time. It's a huge difference if you have to write a fixed text or if you just write down what's going on in your mind that moment. And most typing tests unfortunately use rather complicated English words once a while that I use maybe 10 times a year at most.

    Last edited by Mecki (25-Nov-2010 14:17:44)
    Offline
    • 0
    • Reputation: 7
    • Registered: 21-Apr-2010
    • Posts: 818

    Reminds me a bit of the X system in Esperanto:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esperanto … on_systems

    Do sticky keys help at all?

    Please keep reporting.

    --
    Physicians deafen our ears with the Honorificabilitudinitatibus of their heavenly Panacaea, their sovereign Guiacum.

    Offline
    • 0
    • Reputation: 23
    • From: Belgium
    • Registered: 26-Feb-2008
    • Posts: 482
    DreymaR said:

    For the Umlaut/Diaeresis, I use a Linux-like approach: The colon key (for its mnemonic likeness to an umlaut) together with AltGr is a dead key for the accent. Similarly, the apostrophe key gives me the acute accent, the hyphen gives macron and the comma cedilla etc. - all fairly intuitive. Since I need umlauts and acute accents relatively often, it makes sense to have these in easily available positions on the keyboard. I think it works very well for me.

    I like the Compose key method better; [Compose] + ["] + [a] = ä (consecutive keypresses, not AltGr+key combinations, they hurt my hands less).  In X11 (Linux/UNIX) you can compose a gazillion different characters that way; accented letters, ligatures, currency symbols, mathematical symbols, and many many others.

    I usually map it to the Windows "menu" key.  On a 105/ISO keyboard I think I'd map it to the additional symbol key (left of Z).

    Offline
    • 0
    • Reputation: 214
    • From: Viken, Norway
    • Registered: 13-Dec-2006
    • Posts: 5,361

    My "adjusted" layout is currently implemented for Windows only, and the canonic method there is dead keys as you well know. Ways to skin a cat, is my sentiment. However, I try to harmonize my dead keys better to the Compose key mappings! I didn't choose the " for the diaeresis/umlaut accent because a) I'd then have to press Shift+AltGr for a very common accent and b) the "+AltGr dead key is better used for the much rarer double-acute accent. The other accent dead keys are looking to their compose key counterparts as far as possible.

    I don't find AltGr mappings hurtful (and they're damn useful for me too!) for two main reasons: I avoid keyboards with overly long space bars if I can (although the one I'm typing on right now has just that - it's a completely lovely German IBM mechanical board from 1985), and I use the Wide mod which makes the AltGr key much more accessible among other things.

    Last edited by DreymaR (26-Nov-2010 08:56:59)

    *** Learn Colemak in 2–5 steps with Tarmak! ***
    *** Check out my Big Bag of Keyboard Tricks for Win/Linux/TMK... ***

    Offline
    • 0