• You are not logged in.

A Kmonad-based 6-layer keyboard configuration

  • Started by stevep99
  • 44 Replies:
  • Reputation: 117
  • From: UK
  • Registered: 14-Apr-2014
  • Posts: 975

No, I never use the not symbol. But since Kmonad/Chysalis/QMK all work by mapping keycodes, and for some reason ¬ exists on standard UK keyboards, it ends up being included (at least, in the case where the OS keyboard setting is UK).

There again, perhaps it's ¬ a bad idea if I did start to use it. I'm ¬ sure I'd use it that often, but there might be some circumstances. As long as I didn't tie myself in k¬s over it.

Apart from that, out of interest what symbols do you think are unintuitive?

Last edited by stevep99 (14-Jan-2022 16:40:00)

Using Colemak-DH with Seniply.

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 210
  • From: Viken, Norway
  • Registered: 13-Dec-2006
  • Posts: 5,341

Oh man, do ¬ go there ∨ there will be hell to pay ∧ we'll all be sorry...

*** Learn Colemak in 2–5 steps with Tarmak! ***
*** Check out my Big Bag of Keyboard Tricks for Win/Linux/TMK... ***

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 11
  • Registered: 06-Jun-2013
  • Posts: 551

I'm semi convinced, but not wholly convinced with those new symbol mappings. I need to think about it more and hope for a moment of clarity on the issue.. (that's quite a lot to hope for)

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 117
  • From: UK
  • Registered: 14-Apr-2014
  • Posts: 975

It comes down to which set of symbols deserve higher priority:
1. the shifted number key symbols

£ $ % ^ &

2. the extra non-alphanumeric key symbols

# ~ \  | 

The original mapping prioritised the first set, the new mapping favours the second.

My thinking is that the second set are used more frequently (I use pipe and tilde quite a lot a but % and ^ are rarer for example) - that said symbol usage tends to vary considerably from user to user, so there's no harm in making adjustments.  Do post if that moment of clarity does manifest itself, I'm still open to interesting ideas!

Last edited by stevep99 (23-Jan-2022 12:27:53)

Using Colemak-DH with Seniply.

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 11
  • Registered: 06-Jun-2013
  • Posts: 551

having thought about it some more, I do use the £, $ and % quite a lot, but I also need # and ~

so having both sets approx of equal value, I think I may as well stick with the original qwerty number row lay out just for the principle of not changing if unnecessary

I use ; and : a lot so home row good for those two

So in summary, I think I will stick rather than twist on the symbols.. juice not worth the squeeze for this particular mod from my personal perspective

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 117
  • From: UK
  • Registered: 14-Apr-2014
  • Posts: 975

It's fair enough, people have a lot of variation in their symbol usage, so custom solutions are often the best. Since I've been using the new version, the main items I need from Symbols2 are $ and _. These are both on Sym2 home row though, so it's no biggie.

By the way, I have changed my primary thumb keys - I can't see myself ever going back to traditional boards now, so I am using the ones below T/G/M/N as my primary four, and aren't using the ones below S and E much. I also got different keycaps for those keys (with a slightly lower profile too, which works well for thumb keys!)  My Atreus now looks like this:


PXL-20220313-172748771.jpg

Using Colemak-DH with Seniply.

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 11
  • Registered: 06-Jun-2013
  • Posts: 551

just had a re-look at the seniply page
looks like symbols and numbers are now different layers altogether
wondering whether to upgrade or not

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 117
  • From: UK
  • Registered: 14-Apr-2014
  • Posts: 975
bph said:

just had a re-look at the seniply page
looks like symbols and numbers are now different layers altogether
wondering whether to upgrade or not

Sorry, I realise I haven't checked in here in ages.
You're right, I've actually gone through a number of iterations and experiments, most of them minor, but sometimes I try out a new thing, and if it sticks, I update the page.

The changes were to address a couple of different issues:
1. I wanted to have all the symbols available in a single layer. Previously there were always a few that had to overflow to a second symbols layer.
2. I wanted an easier way to combine numbers and other symbols with modifiers. Previously, to do say, Alt-1, you needed four keys: Ext-A (to get sticky Alt), then Sym-H to get 1. Now you only have only have to hold down the number-layer thumb key and press A (for alt) and H (for 1).

It's of course entirely up to you if you want to update or not, but if you try it let me know any feedback!

Last edited by stevep99 (24-Jun-2023 11:41:56)

Using Colemak-DH with Seniply.

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 11
  • Registered: 06-Jun-2013
  • Posts: 551

Currently giving it a go.

Prob will take me a while to get used to.

Particularly the different thumb key to layer positions.

Where did you get those cool low profile thumb keys?

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 11
  • Registered: 06-Jun-2013
  • Posts: 551

the switch of the shift and extend keys on the left hand is proving a tricky one!

I previously had extend on the thumb shifter under the 'v' and shift under the 'd'

have now gone with the latest seniply and they are the other way round

I think your way is probably better, but need to rewire the brain/fingers to cope..

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 11
  • Registered: 06-Jun-2013
  • Posts: 551

so your number layer is thumb under the 'c', symbols is thumb under the 'h' and function layer is thumb under the ','?

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 11
  • Registered: 06-Jun-2013
  • Posts: 551

and is layer #1 just so you can switch to qwerty if you need it?

I think there may be a small error in that one with the placement of the 'r' - its coming up as a 'p'

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 117
  • From: UK
  • Registered: 14-Apr-2014
  • Posts: 975

I got the key caps from ebay - I can't find the exact same ones but these look similar.

I've always had the same order for the four main layer selection keys: Extend outer left - Shift inner left - Space inner right - Symbols outer right. You can adjust them if you like, but I do think it's important to have Shift and Space as the two inner ones. The function keys can be selected either with the key below comma, or as before by holding both Extend and Symbols.

The new thumb-related thing is the number-layer selection key, which as you say is below C. I find it works quite well on the left - being the opposite hand to the numbers - especially for long number sequences. If the Atreus had an additional outer layer of keys, I'd probably have it in the CapsLock spot instead.

Good spot on the Qwerty layer R key. In reality I rarely use that layer (hence not noticing the error), but I thought it would be useful for certain situations e.g. gaming where you don't want to rebind keys. I have fixed it.

Last edited by stevep99 (04-Jul-2023 15:51:38)

Using Colemak-DH with Seniply.

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 11
  • Registered: 06-Jun-2013
  • Posts: 551

brilliant, have ordered some!

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 11
  • Registered: 06-Jun-2013
  • Posts: 551

steve have you got to the point where you rarely make a mistake with your thumbs?

for some reason, I seem to have stupid thumbs that struggle to remember what they should be doing.

at least I can currently blame their behaviour on a change of layout ;)

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 11
  • Registered: 06-Jun-2013
  • Posts: 551

having the _ under the - as a separate key on the symbols layer is a big improvement.

I use _ regularly (filenaming) and it requiring two rather than three key presses is a win!

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 117
  • From: UK
  • Registered: 14-Apr-2014
  • Posts: 975

My thumbs mostly are well behaved now ;)  Extend and Symbols are quite solidly in my muscle memory and work well. Yeah, I also am enjoying _, plus pipe | and backslash \ being only two keys is nice too.
The new number-thumb took a bit of getting used to. Probably the most common one I have difficulty with is Shift: the left thumb sits over Extend but has to move right for shift and left for numbers, so coordinating that can be a bit tricky, but I anticipate I will adapt.

Last edited by stevep99 (10-Jul-2023 14:50:56)

Using Colemak-DH with Seniply.

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 11
  • Registered: 06-Jun-2013
  • Posts: 551

PXL-20230717-163703174.jpg
Snap Steve! :D

Last edited by bph (17-Jul-2023 17:49:34)
Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 117
  • From: UK
  • Registered: 14-Apr-2014
  • Posts: 975

Yay, looks great! Although actually mine is now slightly different from the photo - since my function layer key is below comma, I have the "Fun" key there now, and the butterfly key is my number layer selector (below C).

Last edited by stevep99 (20-Jul-2023 08:44:03)

Using Colemak-DH with Seniply.

Offline
  • 0
  • Reputation: 11
  • Registered: 06-Jun-2013
  • Posts: 551

few quick key changes - and we are now synchronised once more!

Offline
  • 0