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    Tried colemak, but had to give it up because it made me dumb

    • Started by dj_ryan
    • 12 Replies:
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    • Registered: 02-Jul-2013
    • Posts: 2

    So I really wanted colemak to work... I gave it a partial college try.

    First off, I'm a pretty advanced qwerty typist.  I can do 80wpm on a bad day.  I have been touch typing for 20 years, and I type hours a day.  I also code professionally, and I have been typing semicolons more frequently than even the most dedicated essayist.

    So I spent about a week of heavy re-training.  I did the colemak master key training, and ultimately passed all of them and ended up with a 30 wpm colemak typing ability.  I am on Mac, so I just did the built-in SW solution.  I also have stickers on my keyboard as well, they can help a bit. 

    So I got up to 30 wpm, I could type without constantly looking at my keyboard, but I found myself still mistyping a lot of keys.  So my WPM might have been 30, but my error rate was probably as high as 10%.  Even slowing down being deliberate meant that I had to think a lot about where I plant my fingers.  I also have my own unique style that isnt pure touch typist.  For example I hit "p" with my ring finger, not my pinky. I also dont use caps lock (remapped to ctrl) either.  So I have really good spatial sense of where the keys are... which is important.

    But like I said, I type some words so frequently and they arent handled by training AT ALL:
    - ls
    - pwd
    - cd
    - ^X^S

    And a few more.

    But what was the critical junction?  Well frankly I can type as fast as I can think, or faster.  I literally dont even think about typing anymore.  But with colemak they typing was like a slow car on a freeway, but instead of slowing down my thoughts, the thoughts all piled up in a million-car wreck.  Literally learning colemak... made me dumber.  Or at least I felt it did.

    At this juncture I can't take that kind of hit.  So bye colemak.

    BTW I was wondering why the iPhone doesnt have colemak, nor dvorak.  And I realized it is because all the auto-correct data would need to be redone.  So it wont be showing up anytime soon.

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    Layout switching always makes you feel dumber, since you feel that your fingers cannot move as fast as you think. All things happen like in replay of a soccer match: things move slowly at an infuriating pace.

    At least things will be like that for the first three weeks, which is the most difficult time. You're not alone. We all experienced and endured it, somehow.

    Had you endured for another 2 weeks, your feelings would move from dumbness to enlightenment. Since we are all dumb anyway, we clearly feel there is nothing different between such emotional states.

    When I could type 25wpm after three weeks, I realized there were no going back. I switched to use Colemak full time and my Colemak speed continued to increase. After 60 days I reached my old Qwerty speed.

    So feeling dumb is normal, and it is even compulsory in layout switching. You don't and can't ignore it, it's part of the switching process. If it hurts you like hell and affects your credibility or your self-image, then that's normal too.

    Wishing you better luck next time.

    Last edited by Tony_VN (02-Jul-2013 09:25:20)
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    Check out tarmak.  It was specifically designed to ease the transition.

    That said, if you literally can't afford any sort of speed hit (which is what you're making it sound like), you won't be able to switch layouts.  You can't realistically expect to be up to speed right away.  Most of the time, people only need to type ~40wpm to work and start benefiting from ergonomic gains after that, but if you're an exception, well, that's the end of it.

    Regardless of layout, you should consider an AltGr mod; those could be very useful for programmers who have to use a lot of symbols.  You could also see if you can't make shorter aliases for "ls", "pwd", "cd"; no reason to type them out if you don't have to.


    dj_ryan said:

    I also have my own unique style that isnt pure touch typist.  For example I hit "p" with my ring finger, not my pinky. I also dont use caps lock (remapped to ctrl) either.

    That's still touch-typing; you don't have to hit every key with the exact same fingers as whoever came up with the standard.  It's stuff like what Sean Wrona does (sort of floating around while strictly using the closest fingers at the time) that's probably no longer touch-typing.


    dj_ryan said:

    I was wondering why the iPhone doesnt have colemak, nor dvorak.  And I realized it is because all the auto-correct data would need to be redone.  So it wont be showing up anytime soon.

    And yet android keyboards with a much smaller userbase somehow have well-acclaimed autocorrect for multiple layouts (c.f. swiftkey).  Had they wanted to, Apple could've had plenty of data from its dvorak users by now.  The real reason is probably nothing more than Apple, as usual, following their philosophy of "we know best and you can either have our way or the highway".

    In either case, typewriter-style keyboards don't really make sense on touchscreens; see this thread.  Thus, there's no serious loss in lacking colemak/dvorak.  It's more the messagease-type keyboards that lead to actual improvements - so much so, that they don't even really require autocorrect!

    Last edited by lalop (02-Jul-2013 21:46:10)
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    Tony_VN said:

    So feeling dumb is normal, and it is even compulsory in layout switching. You don't and can't ignore it, it's part of the switching process. If it hurts you like hell and affects your credibility or your self-image, then that's normal too.

    I wonder if we are talking about the same thing... When I say I feel dumb, it isnt because I am worried someone might see me, but I'm worried because I can't accomplish the kinds of highly abstract and difficult programming work I need to do (deadlines and all).

    So it's not an ego or a speed thing but just a "dur I cant do this work anymore" kind of thing.  I was contemplating sketching code out on... ugh... paper.

    Nope, cant do it!

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    No pain, no gain.

    Totally understand the wall you felt you were up against.   Perhaps you learnt to touch type gradually, so can't remember the keyboard being a barrier to text entry.  I think the keyboard is a huge barrier for text input for millions of people.  It's a huge problem.  Social networking posts, and page comments - suffer as such, and that all results in a huge dumbing down of the general populous.

    Not being able to freely express yourself is a horrible feeling.

    As @Tony_VN said though, most of us are up against it to begin with when learning an alternative layout - or going against the flow - it isn't a nice feeling, but it's normal - and you can ride on past it, given the time and energy.  That's why it's suggested that you choose a holiday - or time where you have a break from work to learn.

    If  you don't have current issues and are not thinking about what your hands are doing and have a great WPM (around 80); then I'd be happy with that.  It's probably best not to rock the boat.

    You didn't say why you wanted to use Colemak in the first place.

    --
    Physicians deafen our ears with the Honorificabilitudinitatibus of their heavenly Panacaea, their sovereign Guiacum.

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    • From: Viken, Norway
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    Layout switching makes you dumb in pretty much the same way as workouts make you weak I think. ;)

    As Lalop said, some people have reported a smoother learning experience using Tarmak transitional layouts. If you do, don't switch too fast as that may be more confusing than helpful it seems.

    *** Learn Colemak in 2–5 steps with Tarmak! ***
    *** Check out my Big Bag of Keyboard Tricks for Win/Linux/TMK... ***

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    • Registered: 24-Jul-2013
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    Actually, I kind of sympathize with the OP because the dumbing down definitely has a bigger role than people normally assume. I also think that a lot of us have this irrational fear of losing a well-trained skill that is not easily dismissed by saying that the alternate skill is superior to it, but requires unlearning the first one..

    Besides, if you're not strictly touch typing, namely using all 10 fingers as they were meant to be used, then analysis of the usage of fingers and hand strain as a result make no sense at all.

    Here's my take on the whole "alternate layouts" issue: http://harishankar.org/blog/entry.php/a … t-business

    I am not dismissing outright the benefits of colemak or other layouts superior to qwerty. Just that, for non-touch typists, the benefits might not be as great because the principle of alternate keyboard layouts is based on minimizing the strain of touch-typing.

    Last edited by harishankar (30-Jul-2013 16:50:09)
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    harishankar said:

    Besides, if you're not strictly touch typing, namely using all 10 fingers as they were meant to be used, then analysis of the usage of fingers and hand strain as a result make no sense at all.

    Uhh.. that's an exaggeration at best.  Hitting certain keys with presumably adjacent fingers, like the OP described, will still yield similar results.  At worst a "true" result would only require a slight modification of the algorithms.  There are even layout analyzers like KLA where the finger hitting each key can be set.

    Edit: it's kinda awkward telling where everything should go, so I'll just reply directly to your blogpost.

    Last edited by lalop (31-Jul-2013 00:36:09)
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    lalop you're probably right at one level, but then I think the incentive to learn alternate keyboard layout is decreased if you don't have a problem typing in qwerty and use some improvised technique that reduces the strain in the fingers and hand. That was the main point of my post. I think we disagree mainly on the "number of people" who touch type on computers. I don't have any stats myself, so I won't press the point.

    Also psychologically, we fear losing skills that have been honed over years, or maybe even decades. And clearly the experience of many of the users here indicate that qwerty typing speed would be lost if one started using colemak or another layout regularly. The similarities seem to add to the confusion.

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    Almost all of us Colemak users have that fear. But after a month none of us miss Qwerty that much.

    You may lose face a bit when you hunt and peck in front of your colleagues in Qwerty computers, but that's all. Who cares?

    How can you cling to your glorious Qwerty days when you have better Colemak future? Life always goes ahead.

    Last edited by Tony_VN (31-Jul-2013 08:13:13)
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    I replied to the blogpost to try to avoid "jumping discussions" - those are always hard to keep track of ;)

    (Incidentally, is it just me, or does my first [ quote ] never seem to be rendered correctly?)

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    lalop said:

    I replied to the blogpost to try to avoid "jumping discussions" - those are always hard to keep track of ;)

    (Incidentally, is it just me, or does my first [ quote ] never seem to be rendered correctly?)

    OT: It's a blog software I coded myself from scratch, so I'm to blame for the system not working right. ;) It's very long time since I looked at the code, so I'll have to go in-depth to see why it doesn't work as it's supposed to.

    Last edited by harishankar (31-Jul-2013 09:00:43)
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    I asked why the OP was wanting to dabble with Colemak in the first place.  To no answer.

    Without surveying people to grab their motives I'll dare suggest that those that eek out alternative layouts are:  the optimisers, the injured (Qwerty/typing casualties), the alternatives (those that like to be different), new touch typists and perhaps; the inquiring minds.

    I'm always curious to find out why a proficient typist that has no typing issues and problems would be looking at alternatives.

    Last edited by pinkyache (31-Jul-2013 12:19:21)

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    Physicians deafen our ears with the Honorificabilitudinitatibus of their heavenly Panacaea, their sovereign Guiacum.

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